# Anaconda license situation at your site? **URL:** \ **Category:** Discussion Zone\ **Tags:** systems, programming-for-hpc, python, anaconda, conda\ **Created:** [August 14, 2024, 2:00pm UTC](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/t/anaconda-license-situation-at-your-site/4005 "2024-08-14T14:00:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![RonRahaman](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/user_avatar/ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/ronrahaman/32/919_2.png) [@RonRahaman](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/u/RonRahaman)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2024, 2:00pm UTC](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/t/anaconda-license-situation-at-your-site/4005/1 "2024-08-14T14:00:43Z")
Hi all, Our site is trying to deal with Anaconda’s ongoing changes to its terms of service, which might make it prohibitively expensive to provide Anaconda as a software module on our clusters. Have any of your sites dealt with this? There was a recent Register article that gives a good introduction to the issue: [Anaconda puts the squeeze on data scientists • The Register](https://www.theregister.com/2024/08/08/anaconda_puts_the_squeeze_on/) Here at Georgia Tech, Anaconda first contacted to our IT governance staff in Sept 2023. At one point, they gave our campus a 7-figure quote for a site license, which is still up in the air. In the meantime, at our HPC facility, we’re continuing to offer Anaconda as a software module. However, we’d like to be prepared for what might be coming, and we’d appreciate any info from sites in a similar situation! Many thanks, Ron * * * Ron Rahaman Research Scientist II, Research Software Engineer Partnership for an Advanced Computing Environment (PACE) Open Source Programming Office (OSPO) Georgia Institute of Technology ---
**Author:** ![ktrn](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/user_avatar/ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/ktrn/32/554_2.png) [@ktrn](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/u/ktrn)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2024, 1:08am UTC](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/t/anaconda-license-situation-at-your-site/4005/2 "2024-08-15T01:08:19Z")
Two cents from Boston University: We discontinued using `Anaconda` a few years ago. Our users have a choice to use either regular `Python` modules (and [set their environment using virtualenv](https://www.bu.edu/tech/support/research/software-and-programming/common-languages/python/python-installs/virtualenv/)) or use `miniconda` modules and use `mamba` and/or `pip` for the package installation. The user home directories on our cluster are relatively small – 10 GB, which is not enough to store the Python packages, so when a new user loads a `miniconda` module for the first time, we [prompt them to select a directory in their project space](https://www.bu.edu/tech/support/research/software-and-programming/common-languages/python/python-software/miniconda-modules/). Once their environment is set, they can use “`mamba`” or “`conda`” or “`pip`” for the [installation of their packages](https://www.bu.edu/tech/support/research/software-and-programming/common-languages/python/python-installs/conda/) We also provide separate modules for the ML academic classes. Many of them use the same set of packages (`tensorflow`, `pytorch` and similar) and to avoid 500+ students installing them in their space, we install them before each semester and provide them with [directions](https://www.bu.edu/tech/support/research/software-and-programming/common-languages/python/python-ml/academic-machine-learning-environment/) on how they can add their own packages and use them for their class. ---
**Author:** ![wwarr](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/w/3be4f8/32.png) [@wwarr](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/u/wwarr)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2024, 8:26pm UTC](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/t/anaconda-license-situation-at-your-site/4005/4 "2024-08-15T20:26:11Z")
At UAB, we’re making a transition to Miniforge and are planning to document the how and why of the transition. We use Lmod, which helps us out a bit, because at some point we’ll set up our Anaconda module(s) to simply emit a warning and load Miniforge instead. Obviously, we can’t stop researchers from using the `anaconda` or `r` channels, but we can educate them about the how and why for the transition, and what they’ll need to do to avoid TOS violations. As far as “forcing” users to avoid the restricted channels, that is a leadership decision and way outside our hands. But if legal action causes us to move in that direction, we’ll be ready with an alternative and training already in place. ---
**Author:** ![RonRahaman](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/user_avatar/ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/ronrahaman/32/919_2.png) [@RonRahaman](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/u/RonRahaman)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2024, 2:29pm UTC](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/t/anaconda-license-situation-at-your-site/4005/3 "2024-08-15T14:29:24Z")
Thanks! I got similar advice from the ACCESS Campus Champions mailing list, too. I think it might be reasonable for us to: - Discontinue our current `anaconda` module, which provides the `conda` program and the Python packages that are downloaded from the `anaconda` channel - Introduce a module for `mamba` or `miniforge`, which will provide the installer and an equivalent set of Python packages downloaded from conda-forge As I understand it from several helpful folks and an [Anaconda article](https://www.anaconda.com/blog/is-conda-free) I found: The license covers the usage of the “anaconda” channel, and `conda` defaults to the “anaconda” channel. Other installers like `mamba` and `miniforge` default to the “conda-forge” channel, so they would expose us to much less risk. Users do appreciate having the set of packages from Anaconda available via a module without having to install the packages themselves. But I’m sure they don’t care if the packages come from “anaconda” or “conda-forge”, and I suspect most of the important ones are mirrored on “conda-forge” already. For a while now, we’ve been gently encouraging people to use `venv` and `pip` more. We’ll keep doing that and maybe start being a bit less gentle 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![bu-bgregor](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/9de0a6/32.png) [@bu-bgregor](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/u/bu-bgregor)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2024, 2:27pm UTC](https://ask.cyberinfrastructure.org/t/anaconda-license-situation-at-your-site/4005/5 "2024-09-04T14:27:08Z")
Update from Boston University: we’ve installed a new miniconda module (which provides conda and mamba) using `miniforge` ([GitHub - conda-forge/miniforge: A conda-forge distribution.](https://github.com/conda-forge/miniforge)). We’re still calling the module “miniconda” for now. We have a setup script for `.condarc` files that users are prompted to run when the first time they load the module, and that is configured to set the channels to `conda-forge` and `nodefaults`. We have for a long time provided a python3 module that includes a large number of Python libraries which is roughly equivalent to the Anaconda “base” environment. During the setup of those modules all Python libraries are installed from Pypi using `pip`, and we encourage users to use the python3 modules unless they need conda environments.